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| < Tactic: The Undermine |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:21 pm
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Poor, Innocent Victim
Joined: 06 Jan 2005
Posts: 630
Location: Canada
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Often used in lieu of, but sometimes concurrently with addressing a challenge or accusation. The accused will attempt to paint a caricatural, written 'portrait' of his opponent or his tactic in a separate thread, painting him in as poor a light as possible in an attempt to deride and discredit him.
Unlike the works of Caricaturist, who amuses himself by creating various internet archetypes which poke fun at people encountered online, the Undermine is a malicious tactic, usually directed at a specific person or persons, and solely intended to make them look bad. It is especially effective when the underminer has the backing of a strong clique who readily agree with the victim's portrayal while simultaneously praising the underminer's wit.
The Undermine is a powerful tactic and can gain its user an advantage when properly employed, but if inaccurate or too obvious it can also backfire and make its creator look immature and vindictive to an objective observer. Since the underminer wants his victim to make an admission of guilt by acknowledging the caricature, an effective weapon to employ against this tactic is indifference.
edited: various stylistic changes and spelling fixes.
Last edited by Slashco on Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:38 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:23 pm
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Rambler
Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 1690
Location: Misourri
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Didn't you two go through this once already?
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There are three kinds of people: Those who can count, and those who can't. |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:25 pm
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Forum Regular
Joined: 01 May 2005
Posts: 705
Location: If; The middle word of Life
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 I just want to say, right out, that I have never and will never do such a thing, and I have never and will never support someone who does this in the thread that it is posted on. I deny it. Period.
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"Here I am. Trying to put sense to it and I know there isn't any."
~Mel Gibson, Mad Max |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:31 pm
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Power-Mad Nazi Mod
Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 2750
Location: Cuba
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*ding ding ding* Round 2 is underway....
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:32 pm
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Poor, Innocent Victim
Joined: 06 Jan 2005
Posts: 630
Location: Canada
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| I have no idea what you people are talking about. :) |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:33 pm
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Forum Regular
Joined: 01 May 2005
Posts: 705
Location: If; The middle word of Life
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| Slashco wrote: |
I have no idea what you people are talking about.  |
DENiER!!! BURN THE DENIER!!!
Someone else edited this. I didn't.
_________________
"Here I am. Trying to put sense to it and I know there isn't any."
~Mel Gibson, Mad Max
Last edited by WillWonk on Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:49 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:34 pm
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Poor, Innocent Victim
Joined: 06 Jan 2005
Posts: 630
Location: Canada
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| I contend that I have never denied anything, since I deny that there was anything to deny in the first place. |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:43 pm
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Power-Mad Nazi Mod
Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 2750
Location: Cuba
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Then that denial is an admission of guilt! BURN THE DENIER!
I think irritus's thread was an attack on Alistair not you persay.
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:45 pm
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Rambler
Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 1690
Location: Misourri
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| Lord Cheesus wrote: |
Then that denial is an admission of guilt! BURN THE DENIER!
I think irritus's thread was an attack on Alistair not you persay. |
Maybe he's trying to say that there's no difference. No! that would mean more of the dreaded 'D' word...
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There are three kinds of people: Those who can count, and those who can't. |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:46 pm
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Verbal Juggernaut
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 981
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Are we done making denial jokes? 'Cuz if we aren't I want to join in on the punning.
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KILL IT WITH FIRE! |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:46 pm
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Power-Mad Nazi Mod
Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 2750
Location: Cuba
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| Theognome wrote: |
| Maybe he's trying to say that there's no difference. No! that would mean more of the dreaded 'D' word... |
Bad theo, bad bad Theo! Don't encourage it to amke yet another sock and waste our time.
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:50 pm
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Rambler
Joined: 05 Apr 2005
Posts: 1690
Location: Misourri
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| Lord Cheesus wrote: |
| Theognome wrote: |
| Maybe he's trying to say that there's no difference. No! that would mean more of the dreaded 'D' word... |
Bad theo, bad bad Theo! Don't encourage it to amke yet another sock and waste our time. |
true enough. We've got plenty of other folks to waste time with as of late...
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There are three kinds of people: Those who can count, and those who can't. |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 8:54 pm
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Abusive Admin
Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 6059
Location: The Archive of Fortitude
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| Slashco wrote: |
Often used in lieu of, but sometimes concurrently with addressing a challenge or accusation. The accused will attempt to paint a caricatural, written 'portrait' of his opponent or his tactic in a separate thread, painting him in as poor a light as possible in an attempt to deride and discredit him.
Unlike the works of Caricaturist, who amuses himself by creating various internet archetypes which poke fun at people encountered online, the Undermine is a malicious tactic, usually directed at a specific person or persons, and solely intended to make them look bad. It is especially effective when the underminer has the backing of a strong clique who readily agree with the victim's portrayal while simultaneously praising the underminer's wit.
The Undermine is a powerful tactic and can gain its user an advantage when properly employed, but if inaccurate or too obvious it can also backfire and make its creator look immature and vindictive to an objective observer. Since the underminer wants his victim to make an admission of guilt by acknowledging the caricature, an effective weapon to employ against this tactic is indifference.
edited: various stylistic changes and spelling fixes. |
1) Caricaturist isn't a warrior.
2) This suggestion is itself, and a poor one.
What's the matter? Didn't like my further crippling S_C's brilliant tactic of making a baseless accusation because she knew our forum's counterculture cliqué would latch onto it and mindlessly repeat it? The lot of you are more of a cliqué than we are. At least we disagree, instead of mindlessly backing one another like S_C did for A_B.
| Lord Cheesus wrote: |
Then that denial is an admission of guilt! BURN THE DENIER!
I think irritus's thread was an attack on Alistair not you persay. |
Quite right, I was aiming solely for S_C and A_B. Slashco's participation, to me, seemed mostly for amusement purposes.
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Tireless Rebutter / Archivist
The Grand Suggestion List |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 10:51 pm
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Space Whale
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 2410
Location: Far, far away from wherever you are
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Bah! You are all GloryVics! [/random Spam]
_________________
Every person alive lives in their own personal alternate reality.
Good luck trying to get other people into yours. |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 10:56 pm
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Forum Regular
Joined: 01 May 2005
Posts: 705
Location: If; The middle word of Life
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| Smite wrote: |
| Bah! You are all GloryVics! [/random Spam] |
You make words like fag. [/patois-troll]
_________________
"Here I am. Trying to put sense to it and I know there isn't any."
~Mel Gibson, Mad Max |
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Sun Jun 05, 2005 10:59 pm
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Space Whale
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 2410
Location: Far, far away from wherever you are
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| WillWonk wrote: |
| Smite wrote: |
| Bah! You are all GloryVics! [/random Spam] |
You make words like fag. [/patois-troll] |
Shmeh! I not being you Wiseman in hotsoup. Not always Having yes. Green years? Much.
_________________
Every person alive lives in their own personal alternate reality.
Good luck trying to get other people into yours. |
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 12:06 am
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Forgotten Horror
Joined: 31 Jan 2005
Posts: 2531
Location: Outer Space
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| Long live the nonexistant congratulatory clique! |
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 12:17 am
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Poor, Innocent Victim
Joined: 06 Jan 2005
Posts: 630
Location: Canada
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| Quote: |
1) Caricaturist isn't a warrior.
2) This suggestion is itself, and a poor one.
What's the matter? Didn't like my further crippling S_C's brilliant tactic of making a baseless accusation because she knew our forum's counterculture cliqué would latch onto it and mindlessly repeat it? The lot of you are more of a cliqué than we are. At least we disagree, instead of mindlessly backing one another like S_C did for A_B. |
1) He should be (I used Mike Reed as a model)
2) Ooh, what a surprise, Mr Prickly Pear doesn't like the taste of his own medicine. 
Regardless of whatever motives you claim, you gotta admit you do this a lot.
FYI, I am not a part of any group since this whole 'conflict' seems rather silly to me, like two self-righteous armies warring endlessly while blaming each other for it. I just take the underdog's side for a bit of fun, and make my own observations along the way. |
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 3:03 am
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Tireless Rebutter?
Joined: 18 Feb 2005
Posts: 251
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| Smite wrote: |
| Bah! You are all GloryVics! [/random Spam] |
[grammarian]Tags must be in pairs, one opening and one closing tag.[/grammarian]
(I hate grammarians.)
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Avast ye varmints, an' prepare t' be boarded!
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 5:59 am
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Space Whale
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 2410
Location: Far, far away from wherever you are
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| Kung-Fu wrote: |
| Smite wrote: |
| Bah! You are all GloryVics! [/random Spam] |
[grammarian]Tags must be in pairs, one opening and one closing tag.[/grammarian]
(I hate grammarians.) |
[]SPAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![/]
That was known as the Speaks-for-itself tags....
_________________
Every person alive lives in their own personal alternate reality.
Good luck trying to get other people into yours. |
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 9:49 am
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Verbal Juggernaut
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 981
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Aghhh! The overuse of exclaimation points makes my eyes bleed!
_________________
KILL IT WITH FIRE! |
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 11:51 am
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Power-Mad Nazi Mod
Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 2750
Location: Cuba
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God this whole counterculture clique is starting to sound like a broken record.... Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....Congraulatory Clique .... GloryVic ....
Bah, I blame Alistair for this mess.
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 12:00 pm
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Poor, Innocent Victim
Joined: 06 Jan 2005
Posts: 630
Location: Canada
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If it's indeed mentioned so much, maybe there is a grain of truth there, no?  |
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 12:04 pm
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Hells Kitchen Enforcer
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Posts: 655
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Don't forget that this Thursday is the FW "Clique Recruitment Drive"
Remember to dress professionally and bring plenty of resumes.
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 12:19 pm
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Space Whale
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 2410
Location: Far, far away from wherever you are
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Dress Professionally...Does that mean I get to wear a Toga?
_________________
Every person alive lives in their own personal alternate reality.
Good luck trying to get other people into yours. |
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| Posted:
Mon Jun 06, 2005 12:20 pm
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Power-Mad Nazi Mod
Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 2750
Location: Cuba
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| Slashco wrote: |
| If it's indeed mentioned so much, maybe there is a grain of truth there, no? |
Nope.
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 5:06 pm
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Forgotten Horror
Joined: 31 Jan 2005
Posts: 2531
Location: Outer Space
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| Slashco wrote: |
| If it's indeed mentioned so much, maybe there is a grain of truth there, no? |
Argumentum ad nauseam. |
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 6:14 pm
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Abusive Admin
Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 6059
Location: The Archive of Fortitude
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| Slashco wrote: |
| Quote: |
1) Caricaturist isn't a warrior.
2) This suggestion is itself, and a poor one. |
1) He should be (I used Mike Reed as a model)
2) Ooh, what a surprise, Mr Prickly Pear doesn't like the taste of his own medicine.
Regardless of whatever motives you claim, you gotta admit you do this a lot.. |
1) No, it was just an insulting, elaborate version of Therapist.
2) Ooh, what a surprise, Mr Evil Clown implies I can't take what I give simply because I acted like anyone else would when attacked.
I do not deny writing up things based on what I see people doing. However, I am right when I say this is a bad description. Your first mistake is mixing in a contextual insult (i.e. the clique remark). Your second mitake is in implying that the goal of a tactic to undermine someone's credibility is to get them to admit it. That is ridiculous. You undermine someone to make them look bad to others and to insult them. If it was an accurate undermine, they wouldn't need to admit it for other people to buy into it.
You really need to stop working the cliqué into all of your jabs. I find it sad that you and A_B are so inept that you cling to the first slightly clever thing to be said against us. It's made your poor trolling and stick poking easier, and you mistake the indifference you get for irritation.
The reason we mock you two for clinging to that is because not only are you both unoriginal, but it's not even a good attack. We're not united against the three of you. You're trolls. You attack us, we counter-attack. The problem isn't that we're a cliqué, it's that you all engage us and think you should be above reproach. There's no conspiracy keeping you down; you're attacked because you provoke it.
_________________
Tireless Rebutter / Archivist
The Grand Suggestion List
Last edited by irritus on Mon Jun 06, 2005 6:17 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 6:16 pm
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Poor, Innocent Victim
Joined: 06 Jan 2005
Posts: 630
Location: Canada
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[grammarian]There is no accent on the final e of 'clique'.[/grammarian]
That's really the only thing I paid attention to out of that borefest. |
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Mon Jun 06, 2005 6:18 pm
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Abusive Admin
Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 6059
Location: The Archive of Fortitude
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What a surprise. Avoid listening so you can pretend you're winning. Haven't seen you do this before.
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Tireless Rebutter / Archivist
The Grand Suggestion List |
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